Unalaq vs P'li

Looked for this and surprised it wasn't done before.

P'li decides to take her revenge on Unalaq, and end him once and for all. Can Unalaq successfully defend himself or will P'li have justice for his betrayal?

Fight takes place in the Crystal Catacombs.

Morals off, win by death or incap.

Standard gear.

Time is perpetual twilight.

Round 1:Unalaq is pre-fusion. He starts next to the river and the distance between combatants is 40 ft.

Round 2: Unalaq is post-fusion (no DAS). He starts 20 ft away from the river and the distance between combatants is 100ft.

Callouts

P'Li is actually not as impressive as I once thought, looking back on feats. Unalaq wins.

Hmmm P'li wrecks Pre Fusion Unalaq but Post Fusion I would say would probably win mid-high diff. Though I could really see P'li pushing him into high diff.

Unalaq wins. Lots of cover from her combustion blasts, and a good amount of water for him to use.

Unalaq takes it in this location...P'Li does not have many open shots and she could hurt herself with her own blasts quite easily...

@geekryan: @amonfire1776: The catacombs aren't that much of an enclosed space. There's like, 4 pillars and the rest of it is pretty open/covered with crystal which P'li would melt through anyway.

I can see Unalaq taking a 6-7/10 majority, but P'li will make him work for it.

Unalaq wins with mid difficulty, 8/10.

He's better at everything other than sheer power, which is litteraly the only thing P'Li has.

@vengefulshot: Where do they start?

Unalaq, but P'li will definitely make him work for the win.

Hmmm, Unalaq has the advantage of much greater versatility, and he's one of the relatively few benders powerful enough to theoretically stand up to a combustion bender 1v1

That being said, the Catacombs does not have the same water supply as the Poles (where we see Unalaq's best feats), and while it's still a substantial amount of water, might not be enough to effectively deal with P'li's raw power. There's a reason it's always taken a surprise attack/team effort to deal with a combustion bender, imo

Unalaq in a good fight

Since Unalaq doesn’t have Post fusion feats, I’m going with P’Li in a good fight

@justicethorpsylocke: He does tho.

@anthp2000: Oh. Then he wins just barely

@vengefulshot: 4 large pillars and many crystals. Unalaq is a smart fighter and he's very mobile on a water spout, so he could easily dodge and weave around and use the pillars and crystals as added cover.

@darthfallax: Unalaq where Aang is and P'li on the other side of the river.

I guess depending on the distance between Unalaq and the river, P'Li could demolish him through wild spammed quick draw exlposions, since Unalaq's not agile enough to dodge more than a single one physically. However, I doubt that would happen for more than a couple of rounds, let alone a majority, Unalaq can summon a water spout almost instantly and without any requirement of being inside the water source. Plus, he's superior to her in reactions and combat speed.

Hmm, going with Unalaq. P'li should be able to destroy large amounts if water, but with the help his great scale, he should be able to close the distance with several waves, and dodge with his spout. It wouldn't be easy.

Edit: Also, that Unalaq pic is 10/10

@darthfallax: @shepardoakenprime: @viren809: @arcus1: @killerwasp: @geekryan: @justicethorpsylocke: @anthp2000: @major_hellstorm: @tektonic:

Since everyone was saying Unalaq, I made some modifications and added a round 2. What do you guys think now?

P'Li destroys him in R1. Other than fighting Tonraq and soloing the Book 2 versions of Mako and Bolin, Unalaq didn't do anything impressive. He lacks the agility to keep up with her offensive capabilities and his own power cannot stand up to hers. Outrunning her isn't an option either, since unlike Combustion Man, she's respectfully precise with her beams.

As for R2, I'm staying with what I said before.

Probably P'li for R1, Unalaq R2.

@vengefulshot: distance is literally the only reason why Pli would/could win. make it more of a distance. This doesn't matter if its pre or not fusion Unalaq he's gonna be taking tons of unnecessary blows.

p'li

This, and I just rewatched Book 2 and Unalaq actually never soloed the bending brothers. He more or less stalemated them. Still impressive, as Mako and Bolin are one of the most fierce duos in the verse, but Post Fusion Unalaq could have done better.

@justicethorpsylocke: Mako and Bolin weren't that good during S2 at all..

@viren809: Not individually maybe, but their teamwork still made them very powerful. There are not many benders who could have replicated Unalaq’s feat against them

bump

Unalaq both rounds. Unalaq is probably the best fighter we have seen in the show, bar none.

Unalaq's defenses won't work for him as effectively outside of the Poles. While there is a lot of water here, I don't think it's enough. I think he would need to be able to utilize the entire environment to win against P'Li. I'm not confident he could block a combustion blast. His attacks were going pretty even with Mako's. On round two, I see Unalaq's post fusion state being enough of a power boost to compensate for this. He will be able to spout up and keep P'Li on the defensive side with his attacks and better mobility.

that took some of my appetite away.

Bump

@cryolancer47@minhcake@mrblackdragon@mantraxsp@korraalone@geekryan@anthp2000@viking1205:@chloros:@bigdreamer48:@edgelord91:@vengefulshot:@byondeon:@eslay03:@aystarr@stratospher@kataraaaa@agmine570@psychoboy4eva

Round 1. P'li instantly wins

Round 2. This is much more interesting but I think I would ultimately give it to Unalaq

P’li wins against Unalaq without spirit shenanigans

Round 1: Speed and precision vs power and scale. P'Li can dodge Unalaq's attacks with her agility or evaporate them with her fire blasts, where he can't reliably block or dodge without his large ice walls or water spout, which he doesn't have Pre-Fusion. This will be the clincher for what will otherwise be a very tough fight, where Unalaq can still score some wins the same way he almost killed Korra in their first fight (except aiming for P'Li's third eye). She still wins 7/10, high-extreme diff.

Round 2: Could go either way, although in this enclosed environment that restricts Unalaq's mobility on a water spout, as well as possibly giving him the problem of debris from rock structures behind him that were blown off by P'Li's combustion blasts that he dodged; she wins 6/10, extreme-diff.

Pre-Fusion Unalaq could probably match P’li’s potency. Based on how easily they both cleared Tonraq’s defense in a strangely similar way, oneshot capacity ect. No-selling Korra’s firebending is pretty great, and his mobility could pose a genuine issue for her. I think her attack rate edges out the fight though, it’s hard for me to see P’li losing to really anyone who doesn’t have crazy scale.

Post-Fusion wins, consistently and decisively

R1) P'li takes it pretty handily. Unalaq has knowledge of P'li from his time with the Red Lotus, and the precision and battle IQ to make good use of it, but he's got neither the defenses nor mobility to deal with her assault long enough to pull such exploits off for a majority.

R2) Pretty split on this one actually.

Post-Convergence Unalaq has the speed and evasive flexibility with spouts, that paired with his power and knowledge of P'li would suit him up well for keeping her at bay. Paired with his attack speed, precision, and battle smarts, Unalaq has a genuine shot at finding/setting up and exploiting an opening as both fighters rev up in the mid-fight.

At the same time, P'li's blasts make most frontal attacks on her useless, while her agility lets P'li cope with many attacks that do flank her (unless she's fully caught off by a trick of his). She'll more often than not beat him if they ever enter a head-to-head for a sustained period of time, and I do believe she could cause Unalaq to pause long enough to take him out if she strikes his spout with a well-aimed blast. (Which I do feel she has a good chance at as they reach later-fight scenarios, between her curving shots and rapid rate.)

Between Unalaq's edge in the mid-fight and P'li's in its later stages, I ultimately lean towards the combustion bender in a gun-to-the-head situation - but again I can see both arguments here.

Pli wins the fraud in every round.

I'm gonna need to be walked through this one. Slowly. As though I were a child. In second grade.

@supremegeneration said:

Well before that happens you’re going to have to elaborate on what you’re asking me to point out that I haven’t already. Because I don’t know what you’re confused about

I want to be clear that, as several Viners can attest, I have several slow moments, so I might actually need you to bear with me on this one lol. I'm not trying to argue who wins here, I'm just genuinely curious how you arrive to your conclusion that "Pre-Fusion Unalaq could probably match P'li's potency". As always, correct me if I misinterpret anything, that is never my intention.

Based on how easily they both cleared Tonraq’s defense in a strangely similar way, oneshot capacity ect.

This to me is just flawed logic at it's core. Clearing something similarly doesn't indicate parity, first of all. If the Hulk and Spider-Man both punch through a wall, that doesn't make them equals, it just means the wall is hard-capped below both of them. What you are saying is P'li's offense > Tonraq's defense and Unalaq's offense > P'li's defense, thus Unalaq's offense = P'li's offense.

It's not even a "strangely similar way". Unalaq shot through the individual focused points blasted water at, P'li blew the whole shield up. Similarly, being able to one-shot someone doesn't mean you're on the same tier as someone else who can one-shot someone for the same logic as above.

It's no worries. I've never been one to get mad because someone tagged me or asked me to follow up on a take. It's the reason the site exists.

Anywho, just to make it clear. I believe Post-Fusion beats P'li, while Pre-Fusion loses. I think Pre-Fusion is on a similar level to P'li though, in all aspects really. I think he's the more skilled bender, is the more clever and lethal fighter, and he just in general has the same vibe as Tenzin does lore/portrayal wise, in being a grandmaster good enough to teach Korra and expand his element in never-before seen ways. He also seemed to be the leader and smartest of the Red Lotus, which doesn't necessarily mean he was the strongest, but I do this it's something to note. The reason I bring up Tonraq, isn't necessarily to do a flawed version of transitive property, but moreso to say I believe Unalaq could've performed P'li's feats against Tonraq with the same ease. Unalaq's waterblast completely cleared a thicker wall, and considering the full scale of the waterblast is there, and no momentum was lost, if Tonraq was hit by it, I definitely think it would've yeeted him the same way P'li's did. Tonraq's wall here was larger in scale, held up longer, and wasn't defended against a surprise attack. The reason P'li's blast "did more", is because water doesn't explode, and the actual aoe/blast radius of Unalaq's attack wasn't on par. In terms of the actual potency and damage the attack would've caused to Tonraq specifically though, I think Unalaq's would've done just as much, if not more. Korra is very durable, so being able to oneshot her is a serious feat to me, Kuvira wasn't able to do it, for example. Putting an extra bit in spoilers if you care enough to read it.

Unalaq is as good as cannon fodder to P'Li under normal circumstances. No comment on him under the influence of Vaatu and the Harmonic Convergence, though.

Personally, I don't think there was ever intended to be a significant difference between pre-fusion and post-fusion Unalaq outside of vague spirit powers/dark avatar state. I think he was just intended to be a master waterbender who wasn't pushed to his limit until fighting with Korra. That being said, his feats aren't sufficient to take P'li prior to his fusion with Vaatu and subsequent fight with Korra.

With post-fusion feats, Unalaq might be able to edge P'li out, but I'm not sure if he could in this environment. Without the essentially endless water supply of the South Pole, P'li might be able to blast through his defenses faster than he can replenish them. However, that would require P'li to be able to maintain a steady barrage of powerful blasts (not her lower-end showings). I tend to think that combustion benders beat most other benders in a 1v1, but Unalaq might be one of those few benders who could win this kind of confrontation by virtue of his raw power and mobility (if he's still able to capitalize on these things in the Catacombs)