Goku's "True Ultra Instinct" compared to "MUI"

The Granolah arc is quite confusing scaling wise, but I think I've put my own thoughts on how Goku's new Ultra Instinct form works.

I believe TUI has to be atleast a little stronger than MUI, considering Gas made the wish to become the universes strongest after Granolah made it, and after Goku and Vegeta trained post-Moro arc. It wasn't just because he wasn't calm that he couldn't handle Gas imo, his current form of MUI just wasn't gonna handle it. It doesn't even increase in power the same way Ultra Ego does. Vegeta even mentions this in a way of speaking.

So Goku needed a new form to face Gas. Not only a form that doesn't require to be calm, but also one where it can match or surpass Gas in power.

And that form was UI Omen. But of course, it needed to be an evolved version.

This new form of UI lets Goku use his emotions and power to his fullest at the cost of less instinct and defensive properties the silver hair form has.

Even if you disagree with this new form being stronger than MUI, it has to be at the very least equal to it in power because it makes no sense if it wasn't and Goku is somehow able to fight on par with Gas.

In short:

MUI = perfect defense

TUI = perfect offense

Thoughts?

I don’t really mind it, but I got a feeling he’ll whip out “True Evolved Ultra Instinct Max” soon enough.

It is stronger than MUI. You don't need any more confirmations beyond it being capable of dispatching Gas while MUI was not.

Goku having access to emotions (whatever disney bullshit Toyotaro means by this) makes for a stronger Goku than the emotionless MUI Goku is. It's really that simple.

Well I'd say MUI is mostly flawed in that he doesn't have enough training with it to maintain it for long periods of time. In this sense it would definitely make it weaker compared to TUI which can grow stronger based on emotion.

UI Susano however should be the peak of his power atm

UI Susano is an ability only MUI seems to posses but we don't seem to really understand it's true purpose. Maybe it's a final trump card.

I've always interpreted it as Goku not being able to properly utilize MUI, his emotions always get in the way and make the form suboptimal, with the added issue of the form taking incredible an incredible amount of stamina. Goku can have moments of utilizing the form to it's fullest potential, basically entering "the zone", but eventually he'll return to normal and the form won't work properly because his mind wouldn't be completely clear. With TUI I think that problem gows away and he gets to use the forms full potential without having to clear his mind. This makes the form much more reliable and stable in its power, something that MUI lacks.

So basically I think TUI is much more practical and provides a level of power that is higher than the suboptimal MUI Goku gets when his emotions distract him. MUI becomes more potent than TUI only when Goku enters "the zone", but at this moment he can't do that on command so his usual MUI form is below TUI.

It made no sense whatsoever, MUI is supposed to be the ultimate form of Ultra Instinct but now we have one that looks almost identical to sign, the heck?

The scaling in the Granola arc is wack tbh, they would've made more sense to give him a new form

Yeah, TUI is just straight up stronger than MUI right now. I think it's a better path for him than the latter anyways, since their powers are mostly derived from emotion anyways.

Also makes me wonder if that giant form is something only MUI can do.

Lame. This is a distinction that didn't need to made. Also mui is just a misnomer now since he obviously hasn't mastered ultra instinct. And how could this be an evolved form of ui omen if defense was the basically all that form had?

I still believe MUI is still stronger than TUI since he hasn't master it. Though TUI is better then regular UI since he's able to maximize his offense.

I have no idea cause while this performs good he goes back to MUI and tosses gas to space. Either way while I liked omen’s design more than MUI I hate TUI is just omen but with the initial principles for UI ignored

Dragon Ball Super Goku, and Vegeta are weaker than GT. This has really low showings.

I just explained it in the OP.

@takenstew22: I know. I read it. It just doesn't make sense. How could it be the evolved form if it's function is basically the exact opposite?

Bad writing.

I refuse to call a form that outright ignores the core principles of UI as TUI. It's just Sign with plot power.

Also PUI chucked Gas into space. It's clearly stronger.

That was a Susano avatar tho.

"TUI basically contradicts the whole concept of MUI"

It's obviously more powerful, but I don't think there's any real reason as to why.

Sorry but I'm Taking MUI anyday, Toyotaro's messing up it's concept bruh. And IMO, allows me to have more focus better.

But for scaling/usefulness in the narrative, it genuinely blows MUI Out of the water tbh.

MUI was fucking perfect, why did Toyorarou have to mess this up??

Being more "effective" doesn't necessarily mean more powerful.

On-paper, MUI is stronger than TUI (it is an upgraded Black Haired UI form where he can use his own unique version of UI with his emotions to fuel it instead of UI Sign. It is same transformation as Sign but different UI and different multiplier + it is no longer an incomplete form)

However for Goku, TUI is the superior form for him in combat as Goku verbatim states it utilizes his power the best. He can command it better and draw out more power from it for now

MUI requires a calm and tranquil heart to work which does not suit him since he is not an Angel so he can not command it to the same extent he can with TUI.

The only time it was more effective than ever was when he pulled out the Ki Avatar thing and it was because he lost consciousness at the time. So that was a last resort thing where he surpassed his limits for a brief while (like Whis told Goku in ch 70)

So yeah. Both Black Hair UI and Silver Hair UI have their uses.

Black Hair UI is stronger in general combat while Silver Hair UI is a stronger last resort and limit breaker.

And no. Silver Hair UI is not nerfed this arc like some people try to say before, I hate this agenda coming from misinterpretations to wank ToP Goku and Moro arc Goku. You can not even activate the Silver Hair UI if you are not calm to an extent, Merus said it, Whis said it, Beerus said it (hence why he could not even achieve the full technique) and Toyotaro said it. He just isn't as calm as the Angels or Whis which he literally told him to his face so the only way he could use Ultra Instinct better currently is by creating his own unique version of UI (which Whis told him so)

Nicely said.

@takenstew22: Thanks.

Regardless, this Gas slams any version of Goku xD

Thanks to his curse of being the strongest in the universe

Actually, after reading the latest arcs & further improvements on my DBS knowledge, MUI truly outclasses & that Goku was extremely nerfed in the Granola Arc, soo nothing shows powercreep there.

TUI is better. Not counting Avatar MUI.

No tf it isn't. Buddy stuck in 2022.

The silver-haired form is obviously stronger.

@sheevsmacker: you must be one of those people who think Silver haired UI was "nerfed" in the Granolah arc🤣🤣 You are stuck in a delusion.

@cheeseburgers13: We're told and shown that it isn't as effective when his heart isn't calm. There's no 'delusion' when it's something that is literally in the source material.

Just a weird retcon. His first use of MUI against jiren he's able to fight for like 30 minutes non stop before just being exhausted. Next arc he can't even maintain the form for 5 minutes. Clear regression which people for some reason don't understand. Now he's just not able to control his emotions to use MUI anymore

Its still fodder to the real thing Goku trys to master in base.

My opinion has changed a bit since making this. I think MUI might be stronger when it's fully stable but TUI is definitely stronger than regular Omen.

yep. Stable MUI (eg moro arc) > TUI > unstable gas arc MUI

as whis said, even MUI has ''mastery levels'' to it.

Grand priest MUI > angel MUI > (moro arc goku MUI)>=<? angel trainee MUI >(unstable MUI) initial TOP MUI goku > omen UI goku > beerus imperfect UI.

so in a short, MUI gets stronger by increasing its accuracy. something goku failed to do in the gas arc, much wose is he made it worse by making it unstable due to emotions.

so

that cheese fella is still stuck in 2022

@cheeseburgers13

aye brah, wake up it's 2024

Stable MUI (current Goku seems to have achieved this) > TUI > unstable MUI > UIO

Seems to be hierarchy

Base Goku is treating TUI like a mode, MUI is transformation compare to TUI mode and still currently better due to being mastered,

I could see TUI being the same page of kaioken in the near coming arc, MUI being a mode not a transformation is better choice as he can stack saiyan multiplier in TUI than just training MUI in its utmost limit, Imagine a Super Saiyan 4 Blue Evolution TUI stack with Kaioken, sounds ridiculous but who knows lol.