Wrong forum.

@boltok100: That is not my point tho. The way it works in DB is be more powerful = get resistence to a hax. But that is how it works in DB and that will get thrown away when you use the rules of the other verse you put them against

@kratosx64x: right an it should be treated like a powers set because just like any other ability that's been around the entire series it should be treated as such

More ki/powerful= resistance to hax, but this is generally inconsistent and different verses have different rules. They really have not shown many actual feats to resist against hax, so until shown otherwise I'm not going to pretend they can.

A decent haxxed character with enough speed to contend could slap most of the verse.

To a very limited degree.

They have so many Hax resistance feat.

For example: A bloodlusted Wally West.

resisting hax is part of ki just like everything else that comes with ki.

you cant just throw it out.

Yes they do

Watch the series

whis literaly says ki > hax in the manga.

@afrohead: Eh no. Wally West is wanked and used as No Limits Fallacy most of the time. He can't contend with most of the Skyfathers.

Vegeta resisted absolute zero and TP, jiren resisted time hax, vegito resisted matter manipulation, Goku resisted existence erasure, gotenks and boo can make holes through dimensions with brute strength, etc so yeah they have feats of negativing hax with raw power regardless of what haters say

Exactly and it keeps going lol.

Jiren countering Time Skip is mainly due to his ability to perceive movements in advance akin to what UI can do, because there are many other showings which proves that power alone does not counter such an ability. Hit admitted that Jiren did not straight up power through it, but rather he adapted to it.

But yes, with the exception of Time Skip, DB characters do have feats against hax.

@noobsnowman: what the hell is this?

his ability to perceive movements in advance akin to UI? wtf?lmao.

goku straight up powered through hits time hax.

same as jiren.

in the manga whis literaly says power > hax.

Depends on the hax.

@mainjp: depends on the ki diffrence.

the only thing that worked on stronger characters is mafuba but we dont know how strong the seal itself is only that it needs some1 life force to use.

@arthur_morgan: And it's a hax that power consistently hasn't been shown to overcome.

@mainjp: and again how potent the seal is , is unknown.

@arthur_morgan:

goku straight up powered through hits time hax.

Clearly you didn't watch the part of his fight against Hit when he had to trial and error in his base form before figuring out Hit's Time Skip during the U6 Arc then. Theres a reason why SSB Goku could counter his time hax while SSB Vegeta could not.

same as jiren.

Except that at the start of the tournament it was literally shown that he could perceive the movements before it hit him, he was the only one who didn't move when the rocks were hitting the fighters.

in the manga whis literaly says power > hax.

That's the manga, not the anime.

You basically demonstrated in your post why DB debaters like yourself on average have lower IQ than a normal human being.

@noobsnowman: Hit was close to ssb so vegeta trying means nothing.

goku in kaioken LITERALY ignored his hax becouse of the power increase.

what does base goku have anything to do with kiaoken ssb straight up powering through time hax?

your arguments have NOTHING to do with how goku and jiren actualy ignored Hits hax lmao.

jiren was already cought in his time cage , he still moved and crushed his atack with sheer power.

they even said jiren transcended time and not becouse he measures movement in advance , these two things dont have anything to do with each other.

yes the manga , which works under the same logic as the anime becouse its freaking dragonball stil wether its anime or manga supports my point and you keep talking about things that had nothing to do with how they ignored his hax.

in both anime and manga goku ignored his hax the same way , by powering up/transforming.

like

>jiren walks in hits time cage

>already been cought

>you

>well , he measured movement in advance

what?

yh , about IQ.

becouse percaiving movement in advance somehow lets you move when you already are cought.

you are very smart.

@arthur_morgan:

goku in kaioken LITERALY ignored his hax becouse of the power increase.

what does base goku have anything to do with kiaoken ssb straight up powering through time hax?

your arguments have NOTHING to do with how goku and jiren actualy ignored Hits hax lmao.

What? Goku only used kaioken after figuring out how to counter Hit's Time Skip. He didn't start the fight with KK because he knew it wouldn't work if he didn't know how to figure out how to counter in the first place.

jiren was already cought in his time cage , he still moved and crushed his atack with sheer power.

Red Herring. I am talking about Time Skip, not his Cage technique.

Then again, I doubt you are properly educated enough to know what a Red Herring is.

they even said jiren transcended time and not becouse he measures movement in advance , these two things dont have anything to do with each other.

Really? Because if Jiren can predict movements in advance that literally counters the entire point of Time Skip.

You clearly don't know how Time Skip works, do you? Or is the Tournament of Power the only thing you know about DB?

yes the manga , which works under the same logic as the anime becouse its freaking dragonball stil wether its anime or manga supports my point and you keep talking about things that had nothing to do with how they ignored his hax.

Show me evidence from any statements from authors that just because "its freaking dragonball" means that the anime and the manga works on the same logic.

Good luck with that.

you are very smart.

The only correct part of your post. I, and any other average IQ human being for that matter, is infinitely smarter than you or the average DB debater on the vine, which is pretty worrying to be honest. There is a reason why mods restrict DB debates on this thread, no?

@noobsnowman: holy shit , you blind.

goku used kaioken , rushed hit , hit tried time skip, goku while in time skip still moved as if it was nothing.

he straight up ignored it , he didnt just perceived movement or some bullcrap.

its funny , that before using kaioken and increasing the power diffrence goku never could ignore timeskip like that.

red herring my a**.

time cage is also a time based technique and even a better one, jiren still moved with help of his sheer power even when he was already cought in a time prison.

thats the whole point of this discussion , right?

ignoring time hax with power.

what does transcending time have ANYTHING to do with pre cog?

whats with you and pre cog?

how is that related to jiren moving when he already been cought in time hax?

its clearly you didnt watch anything at all.

talking about as if pre cog was the reason jiren ignored time hax or thats the reason how goku literaly noped time skip , not before hit used it or not after he used but exactly while hit was in time skip.

how pre cog somehow makes you ignore time skip is something probably only ppl with high IQ like you know hahahaahah.

holy Shiiiiiiiiiiiiiit , you want me to show you evidence of the anime working the same as the manga?

whaaaat? is it not enough that every time in the manga hax been countered with power , the same happened in the anime? even jiren ignoring time hax was in the manga.

cool story , but you are wrong lmao.

LADYS AND GENTLEMEN , some1 believing pre cog can ignore time hax is telling me i have low IQ.

amusing.

@noobsnowman:

2:15 , much IQ much pre cog LOLOLOL

5:30 , yes , yes , much IQ much pre cog.

get out of here with your db debater crap.

as if it makes what you say right.

@arthur_morgan: I literally already addressed everything you said yet you repost them as if my arguments weren't there. Furthermore, you can't even type proper English, even a grade 1 kid can type better English than you.

You do realize that Time Cage is a technique that requires Hit to use his power to encage his enemy, therefore it is a power based technique that is completely different than his regular Time Skip, right?

Not to mention, at this point you seem so angry that you can't even type proper arguments or read what I said carefully. I literally showed why Jiren has pre-cog and you made absolutely no attempt to disprove the relevant feat besides whining and crying that it's somehow not.

Goku admitted that to counter Time Skip requires one to adjust their reflexes completely to always anticipate movements in advance, thats why SSB Goku could beat Hit's Time Skip while SSB Vegeta could not, so it is something that power does not offer him. That's the entire point of precognitive abilities that Jiren displayed at the start of the ToP. I know this requires a bit of advanced logic for you to comprehend but I doubt it will get through your thick skull anyways, not that I care whether it does.

You clearly display the maturity of a 9 year old angry german kid. Go back to school and do your homework instead of wasting your time on the internet, your mum probably gave you too much internet quota. Did you seriously call this a discussion when you typed the above? It's me trying to educate an entitled, spoiled child who is trying to justify his ignorance on the subject.

holy Shiiiiiiiiiiiiiit , you want me to show you evidence of the anime working the same as the manga?

....you do realize that the entire point of a credible argument is to provide concrete evidence to back them up, instead of providing baseless assumptions right? Or is this too advanced for you?

You're supposed to know this since middle school. The fact that you don't is frankly very embarrassing and says a lot about you.

whaaaat? is it not enough that every time in the manga hax been countered with power , the same happened in the anime? even jiren ignoring time hax was in the manga.

Yeah this is one cute circular reasoning argument, whats the next fallacious argument you have up your sleeve?

Your last post really shows how you like to fiddle your ego in the jaws of humiliation. As if posting a couple of videos makes your arguments any more valid.

At this rate it feels like I'm bullying a little kid who is probably crying and yelling back in denial, so I feel a bit bad, but 9 year old kids are still 9 year old kids.

@noobsnowman: dude are you kidding me?

i showed goku not perceiving any movement , he straight up IGNORED TIME SKIP.

this literaly got nothing to do with what you are talking about.

you keep mentioning ssb and all that but i mtalking about kaioken IGNORING!!!!!! time skip completely.

holy Shiiiiiiiiiiit.

time cage is still hax and jiren moved with the help of his sheer power while being cought in frozen time.

if it was a pure power technique than jiren would have released himself the moment he was cought.

he moved in frozen time , thats why they stated he transcended time.

another obviouse thing you as a “smart“ guy fail to see.

countering time skip =/= ingoring it completely.

you talk about something entirely diffrent.

im not mad , your stupidity and lack of sight annoys me.

i literaly showed you on screen goku ignoring time skip after powering up and you keep literaly telling me the same thing that got NOTHING TO DO WITH WHAT KAIOKEN SSB DID.

you slow as fuck.period.

@noobsnowman: Damn, this guy talking about some crap that doesnt have anything to do with how goku overpowered timeskip.

its like im telling him kaioken is red and he tells me but ssb is blue so kaioken is not red.

this much sense does your argument make right now.

what you say is not completely wrong but it got nothing to do with how time skip was overpowered.

what does goku blocking hit IN TIMESKIP MODE have anything to do with perceiving movement in advance?

and stop talking all that other nonsense , you aint making more sense with that.

talking about about grades 1 and blablabla.

i , who cant type somehow still makes more sense than you.

talking about ignorance but cant tell the diffrence between pre cog and 100% clear cut obviouse on screen power >>> hax feat.

you blind.

how stupid do you have to be to not see that?

dont expect a reply if you come again with some ssb or pre cog crap.

and dont even talk about my grades or how old i am or how im a whack db debater , YOU DONT look any smarter and you are STILL WRONG.

btw when we talking about debating , YOU have to prove the anime works diffrent than the manga not me proving it works the same becouse its the same thing one is anime and the other manga.

its still the same series working under the same logic.

end of story.

@thedeathstar: What No Limits Fallacies? Speed Steal and Phasing have shown there limits, depending on the Skyfather powerset, he can beat them. Skyfather is only a title after all.

Beerus resists Buu candy beam and Jiren bypass time are among them as well as Freiza resisting Hakai.

@kalder_ridley: because dragon ball characters are literally tiers above them. It would be different if naruto and bleach characters had universal power WITH their hax. No hax from naruto or bleach would ever work on top tier DBS characters.

Not sure about dbz

In DBS,Vegeta straight up negged Absolute zero, Goku and frieza resisted hakai energy ball, jiren and Goku broke through time attacks, Goku destroyed a time dimension of hit, future trunks negged dabura's spit, broly negged SSG Goku's psychic hold by amping up, etc

The concept of resistance to hax/or power is wrong and should be unconsiderable in combat

It depends only on the plot, if the auther wants that character to resist the attack, it will resist the attack(either because it is an important character and must continue in the story or it will have an important rule later), also the most powerful villian must be defeated in the end and their attacks must be overpowered by the heroes, and it happens in all fiction, so unless it is an ability of someone to have resistance to specific hax/power, it shouldn't be applied to anyone just because he resisted that attack without having real ability to resist that attack

Also DB series don't need resistance to hax, the series has a lot of hax itself

In general, yes.

You have characters like Jiren negating time hax due to VERY STRONK POWER MUSCLES.

Nappa basically making Chaotzu's TK hax outright not work due to his Ki being very high and making the Earth shatter.

Vegeta resists Babidi's magic based mind control, which was able to control with no problem characters as strong as Dabura (equal to Cell in power) because of his power.

Vegetto keeps fighting despite being turned into a candy because his Ki is stronger than the caster of the technique.

True Golden Frieza resisted Hakai, a very haxed technique.

Things like that.

Also in DB filler Mr. Popo teaches Goku the ability to resist or shatter illusions and psychic attacks in general, so i guess that also counts as anti-hax.

Tbh I think the Grand Priest could legit resist everything, lol.

I think the better hax resistance comes with the movies and later with DBS. For example if we take Hakai into account. In this scan he speaks about destroying matter. We know it isn´t simple destruction, as he used the word erasure before. That isn´t all, because we are also aware that it erased a soul/ghost, which is also again later backed up by Beerus statement.

For that feat being used on a few DB characters already who resist that sphere of destruction, it would grant already a few good resistance feats:

- Resistance to Existence Erasure (Body and Soul)

- Resistance to Matter manipulation, Atomic Manipulation (Inferior levels of destruction should be also resisted, because resistance to said Erasure should also include automatically those types of resistance)

- Possibly Resistance to Existence Erasure on a space-time level (We know DB characters in different points of time are independent from dying in the present, if for example someone is try to killing you in the past, but Hakai also leave no traces of Zamasu in the future, lik Beerus mentioned, when he erased him.)

In db/DBZ

Nappa resists TK hax

Vegeta resists babidi's mind control

Likewise they have varying resistance to gravity based on their power levels

Vegito retained his consciousness and ability after being turned to candy

Resisted being absorbed too

.in DBS

They resists absolute zero

Resist soul, body and mind erasure

Resist time hax

Resist intangibility

Resist mind control via love

Resist a black hole's gravity

Resist a space warping attack (toppo waored the WoV itself with an attack that Frieza survived)

Beerus was resistant to arale's toon force

@jaakor: they also have reality warping resistance. And something that was said about goku using kaioken in his ssj forms is that it would most likely result in immediate death. And goku has used kaioken multiple times in his ssb form. Kid goku survived drinking the ultra divine water. The extinction bomb has no effect on saiyans.