Kizaru vs Hashirama

Kizaru imo

Lol Ngl Kizaru low diffs with no energy equalization but sage energy is an unknown , but with Equalized Energy , Hashirama low diffs.

Why would Hashirama struggle with someone two tiers behind him in power and around vaguely faster in speed?

The Admiral may be faster, but he sure as hell ain't beating this, while Hashirama easily obilerated it.

contextually, an arguably weaker variant of the same Jutsu defeated Ten Tails Obito.

No one in one piece is near or past Six Path level characters.

Hashbrowns wins?

Much weaker characters than Kizaru are enough to stomp Hashirama

Hashirama already stomped characters who would destroy Kizaru, get past BSM Naruto first LMFAO.

Kizaru due to speed advantage and logia

How does he counter Hashirama's power and power Nullification abilities?

Kizaru spanks from 5 km away

Hashirama can’t even hit Kizaru idk how he’s supposed to do anything

@monkeysdkevin said:

Kizaru spanks from 5 km away

what here is meant to be impressive exactly?

Kizaru too fast & strong. He wins unless Hashirama spawns WoFT.

Kizaru stomp

what makes him too fast and too strong?

Kizaru blitzes and splits him in half. He scales waaaay above baseline ftl not that he needs to here.

Even Doflamingo with his standard strings which could slice and dice Fujitora's meteors would. Hashirama's durability doesn't even scale his higher scale jutsu which isn't fast enough to touch Kizaru in the first place. He could stand completely still and it would phase right through his logia body even.

Hashirama LMAOblitzed Majestic Attire Susanoo and its Bijuudamas, when far weaker Bijuudamas have Lightspeed feats, he genuinely ran miles away from it and summoned five multi mountain sized Barriers between him and it one by one.

Kizaru's faster alright, on this board that is

1. Already is above mid tiers like the Vinsmoke brothers & Pacifistas who are LS/FTL, then we have Doffy whose above that Baseline. WCI Luffy who is above the dudes in speed. And considering Kizaru is hanging with Luffy currently, he's above G4 Snakeman Luffy. So overall, Kizaru's in the FTL+ ranges.

2. Even if we the benefit of the doubt that Hashirama is too strong, he's intangible tbh. But for scaling, he should be at near Yonko tier due to Giving Gear 4 luffy problems, from what I saw, but we'll see as he should be fighting G5 Luffy as of this moment, But I'll leave that to someone else.

@masterbuster666:

1. Already is above mid tiers like the Vinsmoke brothers & Pacifistas who are LS/FTL, then we have Doffy whose above that Baseline. WCI Luffy who is above the dudes in speed. And considering Kizaru is hanging with Luffy currently, he's above G4 Snakeman Luffy. So overall, Kizaru's in the FTL+ ranges.

and...that is impressive why? we've instances in Naruto where people straight up elemental attacks at the speed of light just to get fodderized later on in the novel by holding back Hokage Kakashi, arguably the weakest Hokage phsyically.

the dude wasn't even a kage or anything lmao, and was firing attacks at LS, the acaling of Lightspeed in both verses start from roughly the same point, its just that its the one piece community that bases all its argument around "blitzes"

2. Even if we the benefit of the doubt that Hashirama is too strong, he's intangible tbh. But for scaling, he should be at near Yonko tier due to Giving Gear 4 luffy problems, from what I saw, but we'll see as he should be fighting G5 Luffy as of this moment, But I'll leave that to someone else.

Yonko tier isn't impressive, Hashirama one shotted Madara's Majestic attire susanoo, a weaker or compareable one in the war defeated Ten Tails Obito who would absolutely pulverize any Yonko. Don't even think of debating power because that will 100% not go Kizaru's way.

the only hope is wanking his speed while ignoring Hashirama's.

INB4 planetary lvl hashirama from maulwanker

Hashirama outstats ,but Kizaru is likely faster.

Says the guy who thinks cells aren't made of Atoms

you're better off quite Yray.

Kizaru definitely has the speed advantage over hashirama and can blitz him. Also how is hashirama even going to hurt kizaru?

Hashirama's style of fighting goliath-sized enemies like PS/Kurama is useless here. On top of that, he's a glass cannon and a squishy wizard, who'd get red-misted by any attack from Kizaru if it lands on his frail body, which it it'll due to the enormous speed gap. Not to mention Logia intangibility seals the deal.

@molt: facts. Edo Madara got bisected by Lee. Yeah alive hashi>Edo Madara but kizaru>>>Lee.

Plus piercing attacks

Might wanna mention he was using his power to control the ten tails, heard context is an important part of storytelling

@maulsmacker: and? There's no mention of implication he was weakened in anyway. He even stated he was REINFORCING his control with hash cells. Controlling a tailed beast normally has no effect on stats

neither of them casted a single jutsu or moved while being in control of the Ten Tails, they're using their powers to control the Ten Tails, not to fight, you also forgot to mention how Lee was amped by Naruto on top of his own 5 Gates

Damn, context isn't your friend now is it?

Hashirama. Kizaru dosen't have the AP or speed to keep up

@maulsmacker: Obito used kamui to avoid a rasenshuriken during the same scene and again there's NO implications he was nerfed in any capacity.

Amped 5 gates Lee is still far weaker than kizaru.

Didn't, Kamui is passive, no need to use it, it happens unconsciously

Obito can be sleeping, try it and the same thing would happen

and amped Lee has no feats other than harming Madara, impossible to scale, a later amped Konoha 11 without gates straight up blasted through Ten Tails Obito's Gudodama

@maulsmacker: it's still a jutsu being used which debunks that argument.

As for determining Lee's strength we know he's inferior to 6th and 7th gates guy as well as the movie meteor fest normally. And this amp specifically was 3x kakashi's normal chakra. So still fodder to katakuri

Its a passive jutsu, Obito didn't do anything, you may as well argue harmong a sleeping and paralyzed Obito is a feat now because he can use kamui.

I don't know any of such short, Amped base Konoha 11 blasted holes through the Gudodama, the fact he is amped completely makes his feat worthless, meteor fight is also irrelevant as it was by 5-6G Lee, without any Kurama chakra.

Kizaru wins only because of intangibility.

@edgelord91:

breathing doesn't require chakra usage. It's still a jutsu being used so that argument is mute and there's no case for their durability being lessoned to begin with.

that is such a terrible argument, for Obito using kamui is easier than anything, even breathing as its Literally passive and he needs no subconscious or conscious effort to do it, in the scene you can literally see Madara and Obito just standing around while the shinobi alliance charges them, they don't use any jutsu, even susanoo which Madara uses everytime he is attacked by something, they don't try to block, deflect, react or anything, why? because they are sitting ducks using their powers to control the Juubi, now if Madara cannot even use susanoo what makes you think he is using chakra to augment his stats?

The konoha 11 were amped by a much stronger Naruto and all they did was use rasengans Naruto made before he amped them. Not the same.

they handled the rasengan and reacted to the top speed of the Majestic Attire Susanoo, by far the strongest jutsu in the war till that point, they were amped reslly hard.

We have a point of reference for how much Lee was amped and we know none of his other feats and scaling are even katakuri level. It's not like Madara had particularly good physical durability to begin with

his physical durability, even in Edo Mode, is good enough to tank rasenshuriken, you know the attack where nearly an infinite number of blades enter every cell of your body? and again, his physical Durability is irrelevant as Edo characters have far less durability than their alive selves, so it doesn't matter either way.

How fast is Hashirama ?

Hashirama would lose to doflamingo lol what is this? The speed gap is MASSIVE.

Hashirama wins all OP has going for it is recency bias.

Hashi is only Countrylevel with some Jutsus lol

His own raw stats caps at Mountainlevel.Neither of that can do shit to Kizaru

@edgelord91: Your formating is so bad.

Anyways you should find a partner and do a duo CaV Naruto vs OP against me and Namelessone.

I recommend Eco or Wu because both need a lesson or two.

I will give you a feat for him, you can choose how fast he is more or less

In my opinion, Ridiculously Fast.

Hello, I'm today about to represent a speed feat today that in my opinion goes overlooked to many, so first of all, I will look at this attack from Mifune, the Leader of the Samurai and Land of Iron who is hyped to be kage level atleast, he has this attack called the Beam of Light here is the visual

Anime depiction of the technique

The technique is actually working at the speed of light, consistent with its depiction as well as its namimg, and it's from Mifune, a kage tier opponent

Now Mifune was amplified, by roughly 3 times according to Kakashi statement, but I will be ignoring the amp today and just taking its base speed as thats the bare minimum

Translation credit to Joviolma

Konoha

Hundred Leaves Collection...Part 78

The samurai devotes most of their days studying sword skills in order to protect the Country of Iron. Some of them will learn to move faster than the shinobi by pushing their body forward, and some will simply refine the sharpness of their sword skills...And now, they are going to the Fourth Shinobi World War, a stage to test the sharpness of their swords...!!

←***The light speed blade's slashing attack is sent out and strikes the enemy !*** A blow from the swordmanship of Mifune’s legendary sword Kurosawa comply with this ! !

The secret technique that sparkles on the battlefield: Samurai --- Sharpened Swords ---

This is fate...Their sword skills shined to the maximum degree on the battlefield, and their appearance like that of a god of military arts attracted the shinobis of many countries. And, with the achievement of numerous battles led by the chief Mifune, his strength is propagated to many nations. By means of their military arts, they disciplined others in the existence of the [SAMURAI OF THE LAND OF IRON

↓A sword skill handed down in the Country of Iron. If it's released by a skilled Samurai, it will cut off even steel !!

now that we've established this attack as a speed of light attack, four techniques were fired simultaneously in the war arc, this attack and Bee's Bijuudama were shown to be relative ~ in term of speed because as you can see, the Beam and the Bijuudama reach the Ten Tails at the same time roughly

from this, we can take the 8 Tails Bijuudama as around the speed of light, this makes sense as

- There are many ways to get even Base Bee as a high rel or a bit above fighter

- Even though Mifune is massively amplified by Nine tails chakra and Nine tails cloak, they're still relative so in base they should be too

- Mifune, even with 1/50,000 of Naruto's power should not come close to the power level and inverse standing of Killer Bee

- Bee in base is just as much if not more of a speedster than Mifune, take their respective treatment of Sasuke for example as Mifune fought a Sasuke who was beaten up by Aye

- The Visuals are blatant

so now that we've discussed even Bee Bijuudama should be at LS, a Bijuudama from a fucking Majestic attire susanoo of the full nine tails, who is gonna obviously surpass Bee and 8 tails by an extremely vast margin, should also scale to be either LS or downright FTL

and now is the real speed feat, Hashirama on foot manages to outrun the Bijuudama so hard and then summon five multi mountain sized Barrers after he makes distance between himself and the susanoo amped Bijuudama Madara fired

Hashirama manages to make enough distance between him and the Bijuudama to summon literally 5 multi mountain sized barriers between them each having a vast amount of distance between them, Hashirama was not all that far from the Majestic attire and the Majestic attire itself was chasing him down

This is obviously an immense physical feat to outrun a Bijuudama completely and summon 5+ Multi mountain sized constructs before it can reach you, specially with the speed I established for The Bijuudama, so clearly FTL and potentially a lot higher

people who upscale --> Every Juubito and Up char, Tobirama, MAAAAAAYBE EMS Madara, Maybe BM Minato, certainly Rinnesage Madara.

Edo Madara is also much weaker than alive Madara. After he was revived, he literally pulverized diety gates that were able to tank blasts from Ten-Tails, and which easily restrained his Edo elf, with a flex( so much for "squishy wizard") At which point Hashirama noted that Madara is only regaining his past strength:

So I am not sure why people are even bringing amped Lee damaging Edo Madara who was using all of his power elsewhere here as if that means anything in this fight against prime Hashirama, who stomped alive, not Edo Madara who was using Majestic Attire Susanoo.

OT: This is a good fight, going with Hashirama.

@ruined_king: I'm on mobile which is why I don't do CAV'S. Also if you mean for this match up it most likely would just just devolve into a which Naruto characters can harm kizaru without equal energy argument like it did here.

With equal energy it's MUCH closer but I'd still give it to kizaru because as Molt pointed out hashi's fighting style with his constructs isn't suited to dealing with a small traversable opponent who can just beam past them and he's clearly outmatched by kizaru in direct combat

@edgelord91: We could do any matchup.

One Piece FTL speed is head canon

Naruto characters are superior

@edgelord91:

passive jutsu is still just so that claim still holds no weight.

Again, he didn't attempt to cast any jutsu, he COULD NOT cast a jutsu to STOP the rasenshuriken from cutting his connection to the Ten Tails.

This is just laughably false.

its not one of your args bud

He's been tagged by temari,

she blindsided him when Madara was playing with some fodder

the raikage,

he had no reason to bother

Tsunade,

No reason to bother

not to mention scrapping with Naruto, hashirama, and the alliance all without his susanno

Hashirama can easily bust his susanoo, read their fights, and Naruto never landed one real blow on Madara pre six paths

Thats fair but the rasenshuriken is a piercing attack (even kakazu was technically in one piece)

a tiny ass rasenshuriken from BoS Naruto vs the biggest rasenshuriken ever seen from War Arc Sage Naruto 😭

And that would only put him raikage level which still isn't enough

Which is above Rock Lee, amped lee I dunno

tobirama stated the war Edos were ALMOST at full power and Madara was modified to be stronger than he would've been with hashi's cells. He's still not tanking that kick

Tobirama talked about power, when did he say ANYTHING about durability? yea, never, characters with regeneration has lower durability than most, examples are Orochimaru losing an arm to KN3 just to get it back and Super Buu being pieced by bullets

Naruto got nukes by his own chakra and survived what implies Madara was amping his durability to begin with?

Naruto characters have superhuman stats because they use chakra to amp, thats the basics

And? We gonna argue boruto handling the father son rasengan means he's that level?🤣

if he keeps up in speed then sure he would be that level, the amped Konoha 11 had Bijuu cloaks and massive speed boost, don't try it please.