@transformaa: Disagree I vastly prefer DC to marvel in everything over all DC Films are better The Dark knight trilogy still reigns supreme. I liked Dawn of Justice was a solid 6 or 7/10 whereas Civil War done what Batman V Superman done but they just did it better imo 8/10. I was very surprised as The Winter Soldier I really didn't enjoy and gave that over rated film an average 6/10.
Well, DC is copying Marvel by creating a shared universe.
As someone who thought MOS got way more hate than it deserved....BvS was bad. Just bad. It deserves the scathing reviews (mostly). I know opinions and all that, But I honestly don't see how someone could defend it.
Civil war straight up demolished it in every area.
For the people saying DC copied Marvel's shared Universe, DC has tried to attempt one going as far back as the early 2000, with a, guess what..... BvS movie. The only reason they didn't is 'cause the people at WB are idiots. However, with the success of Batman Begins, and Nolan's commitment on keeping his Universe 'grounded', it never got kicked off.
Seeing how successful Marvel studios was just eliminated any existing fears or hesitations they had, but they always wanted a shared universe.
Marvel on the other hand was still trying to get the rights back to enough of it's characters.
I can't believe people are comparing Zemo (A villain who won in the end after a very smat plan) with Luthor (A villain so stupid he would lose in every possible scenario )
I can't believe people are comparing Zemo (A villain who won in the end after a very smat plan) with Luthor (A villain so stupid he would lose in every possible scenario )
He killed Superman. That, along with defaming Superman's reputation once and for all was his main goal. How did he lose in every possible scenario???? If anything, he won.
@petey_is_spidey: Superman was not dead and by the end of the movie his reputation couldn't be better. people know he sacrificed himself to defeat Doomsday.
Luthor failed miserably and needed to be saved by the person he despised even tough we have no idea why he despised Superman in the first place.
Superman won. He was arrested and brought to shame. If Doomsday had won he would simply be killed by him as he almost was before the final fight. He is the most stupid villain to ever appear in a super hero movie.
@petey_is_spidey: Superman was not dead and by the end of the movie his reputation couldn't be better. people know he sacrificed himself to defeat Doomsday.
Luthor failed miserably and needed to be saved by the person he despised even tough we have no idea why he despised Superman in the first place.
Superman won. He was arrested and brought to shame. If Doomsday had won he would simply be killed by him as he almost was before the final fight. He is the most stupid villain to ever appear in a super hero movie.
Superman is dead. In their world he's dead. To Martha and Lois he's dead. To Luthor he's dead. No one, at the moment, knows he's alive. Luthor won. Of course, he will rise from the grave, but at the moment and in THEIR reality, he is all but dead.
Sure, his reputation is better then ever, but that doesn't change the fact he's dead (TO THEM).
After everything Lex Luthor did in the movie people wen from fearing Superman to loving him.Once he cames back people will receive him with open arms,While Luthor lost his prestige and went to prison, and also gave Wonder Woman and Batman files to all future members of the Justice league.
Why can't people enjoy a movie or hate a movie because they simply like/hated the movie. Nope Fan boy, fan boy everywhere.
I am personally a DC fan boy myself, but that doesn't mean I have to say BvS is better then Civil War, because I don't think it is, is a decent popcorn movie, but is not better then Civil war. I can admit BvS has flaws. I can also argue that Batman was great, the Martha scene was a clever idea and that Lex was a fun villain even though he probably would had been better off being more like Zemo and have him as a villain to set up Batman vs Superman as the center piece with both side having a strong motive to fight. Also not have Superman be side line in his movie.I mean at time Cap was sideline in his movie, but for the most part he was the clear main focus of the movie, and the major character. Superman was just there, with like what one good scene that doesn't involve fighting. At the same time I can say I was not a huge fan of the Civil War ending, but I wasn't a huge fan of BvS ending where they had to show Superman dirt rising. I mean god dammit, I was like well it wasn't great, but at I respect them for killing Superman and setting up the JL, but nope Superman is alive don't worry.
After everything Lex Luthor did in the movie people wen from fearing Superman to loving him.Once he cames back people will receive him with open arms,While Luthor lost his prestige and went to prison, and also gave Wonder Woman and Batman files to all future members of the Justice league.
How in the world did he won?
Again, nothing you said negates the fact that in the present, in THEIR world and in THEIR minds, Superman is DEAD.
And by your logic, Zemo also failed miserably. We all know that the Avengers will be back to together happy as ever, and IM and Cap will be "best buds again" come Infinity War. But for the MOMENT, just like Luthor, Zemo has the victory. In the end however, both have lost.
@petey_is_spidey: Lmfao. I've never seen anyone defend a more mediocre film so feverently than you. Why don't you just change your name to Mommy_is_Martha? ;)
No, but both movies do have faults, and so far it seems to me that many are more willing to overlook the faults of CW probably for the silly DC vs Marvel crap.
I tend to agree that Marvel did it better mainly because they've had setup films. Still, the points you addressed are very true as well. That wall of text though O_o
Ultimately civil war was the better movie but Snyder must have banged the daughters of multiple critics because the hate BvS got was unreal, almost cult-like. Not saying people can't have different opinions but when I think of bad comic book movies (fan4stic, batman & robin, blade trinity, green lantern, spider-man 3, etc.) BvS comes nowhere close. It's ironman 2 lvl which may be the worst of the MCU films but it's still watchable. And even Ironman 2 got mostly positive reviews.
This is ridiculous, these movies were supposed to debut the same day, Civil War´s script was already finished before the first trailer of BvS came out, literally this is a thread made by a fan upset by the fact that Civil War is demolishing BvS.
Kevin [Feige] is a maverick and he’s very sensitive to how people are responding to his content. He said he thought we might be right. And after they announced Batman v. Superman, he said, ‘you guys are absolutely right.’ We needed to do something challenging with the material or we were going to start to lose the audience.
1.wanting to take down a guy who killed your parents isnt the same as instantly becoming buddies because someones mom has the same name as yours.
2.Cap not choosing to kill Tony was taken directly from the Civil War comic.
3. Its not hard to believe that Tony could find out who Pete was. Spidey's a freaking teenager swinging around new york in a homemade suit. he doesnt have Flash level superspeed, technopathy, nor does he live underwater,
4. i think it was pretty clear that Steve would be trying to find and save his best friend since that literally what they said they were gonna do in the last movie.
It's pretty ironic that civil war had so many similarities to Dawn of Justice..Even the same similarities\ plot holes BvS got criticize heavily for. In BvS people and the government think Superman is too powerful and wanted to restrict him; whereas in CW, they think the Avengers are too powerful and UN wanted to restrict their action too. In BvS Batman wanted to take down Superman, in CW Iron Man wanted to take down Captain America. In BvS we saw a very angry Batman fighting Superman and in CW we saw a very angry Iron Man fighting Captain America in their final fight. In both movies they have heavy action. But in BvS they refer the action scenes cgi crap but in CW it's the greatest CB battles of all time. In BvS Superman fought Batman because he wanted to rescue his mother, and in CW, Captain America wanted to save his best friend. Iron Man lost his emotion, and had a Martha moment when he found out who killed his parents, Batman was in the same situation when he thought Superman was mentioning his mother's name and he didn't know why. In both movies, one superhero could kill the other superhero in the battle but didn't at the last moment; One was using a Kryptonite spear, the other one used the Captain America's shield. In both movies, there's a bad guy behind manipulating the fight. Lex and Zemo. In both movies there are bombs going off at hearings and in both movies a main character is being blamed for violent accusations he didn't do. In both movies a genius figured out a secret identity that only he knew about. But Zack Snyder got ridiculed for him have Lex figure out identies for meta humans for 2 years. While Ironman found out who spiderman was in days or even hours..Is that not a plot hole? Or is it not because Disney Marvel can do whatever they want and fans will call it a masterpiece..In both movies the main villains end up in prison..Out of all these similarities..One movie is often referred to being the worst CBM of all time..and the other is being considered the greatest CBM of all time..lol..The Marvel praise is real and the DC hate is manufactured by Marvel fans because I just proved it!
They didn't instantly become buddies. The name "Martha" made batman hesitate. It was Lois who stopped the fight and made batman realize he was acting like the same dbag who murdered his parents.
Lol thanks. Just got to mention that. BvS gets a lot of crap for the Martha moment but people tend to forget that Lois was the one who put a stop to the fight. From there you can infer batman's rational.
Lol thanks. Just got to mention that. BvS gets a lot of crap for the Martha moment but people tend to forget that Lois was the one who put a stop to the fight. From there you can infer batman's rational.
yeah but the whole reason he stopped was because he mentioned Martha... Lois had to explain what that meant but it still doesn't change the flimsy nature to get bats to stop in the first place...
Lol thanks. Just got to mention that. BvS gets a lot of crap for the Martha moment but people tend to forget that Lois was the one who put a stop to the fight. From there you can infer batman's rational.
yeah but the whole reason he stopped was because he mentioned Martha... Lois had to explain what that meant but it still doesn't change the flimsy nature to get bats to stop in the first place...
Well let me ask you why it was flimsy. Hearing an Alien, whom you considered a threat, say your Mother's dead name wouldn't make you stop?
Lol thanks. Just got to mention that. BvS gets a lot of crap for the Martha moment but people tend to forget that Lois was the one who put a stop to the fight. From there you can infer batman's rational.
yeah but the whole reason he stopped was because he mentioned Martha... Lois had to explain what that meant but it still doesn't change the flimsy nature to get bats to stop in the first place...
Well let me ask you why it was flimsy. Hearing an Alien, whom you considered a threat, say your Mother's dead name wouldn't make you stop?
why would it?? she had been dead what 30 years in the movie....
Lol thanks. Just got to mention that. BvS gets a lot of crap for the Martha moment but people tend to forget that Lois was the one who put a stop to the fight. From there you can infer batman's rational.
yeah but the whole reason he stopped was because he mentioned Martha... Lois had to explain what that meant but it still doesn't change the flimsy nature to get bats to stop in the first place...
Well let me ask you why it was flimsy. Hearing an Alien, whom you considered a threat, say your Mother's dead name wouldn't make you stop?
why would it?? she had been dead what 30 years in the movie....
Because it's batman. His parents death haunt him. Covered in the movie.
@blacklegraph: You mean they're more willing to overlook a spot or two in the plot because it's actually a good movie?
Those spots are pretty important ones though, like "why did everyone ignore the fact that an entire psychologist just up and disappeared? How was the villain's entire plan reliant on happenstance?"
The equivalent issues in BvS are blown up as the worst things ever comparatively. Lex is vilified while Zemo is praised for equally wacky stuff.
@newecho: yeah he's hellbent on killing this man/alien why stop because he said your mothers name?
Also what man about to get killed says his mothers first name? Most people call for mommy or Ma sometimes when their about die not their proper name.
Because Superman thought he was going to die so he told batman to save martha. That was the entire reason Superman was fighting batman - for his help to save his mom. I think logic can be thrown out the window when you've been weakened by kryptonite and a boot is crushing your throat while someone is about to kill you with a spear :)
@blacklegraph: Because nobody knew him, he wasn't super important, it just wasn't something to focus on. You're grasping at easily explained straws.
When was Zemo wacky? Oh yes, drowning a man upside down in a sink is wacky, he had such humor to him when he was blowing up the UN and leaving corpses for the maid to find in the bathtub wasn't he?
Luthor was vilified because he was a terrible Lex Luthor, Lex is supposed to have the appearance of power, of strength, etc.... unless you want to go for Golden Age Lex Luthor and make him a wacky Super Scientist.
@newecho: yeah he's hellbent on killing this man/alien why stop because he said your mothers name?
Also what man about to get killed says his mothers first name? Most people call for mommy or Ma sometimes when their about die not their proper name.
Because Superman thought he was going to die so he told batman to save martha. That was the entire reason Superman was fighting batman - for his help to save his mom. I think logic can be thrown out the window when you've been weakened by kryptonite and a boot is crushing your throat while someone is about to kill you with a spear :)
He went there for bats help but never even asked for it. The logic would actually dictate you do the opposite of what you are saying..You would revert back to your most innocent self when put in peril so supes should have said save my mom not Martha. The whole reason for the fight was flimsy but I know you enjoyed the film so I won't try to take your enjoyment of it with me saying negative things about it...
@transformaa: Despite what you brilliantly point out here they won't admit the double standard!...
That's because Marvel fans are hypocrites and have a herd mentality and they go with what the internet says. they went along with critics (who are shady, antireligious, overbearing knowitalls that that only like McDonald milkshake and claim to hate BK milkshake so to speak) .
I personally hate this stupid divide but the double standard is clear!
@newecho: yeah he's hellbent on killing this man/alien why stop because he said your mothers name?
Also what man about to get killed says his mothers first name? Most people call for mommy or Ma sometimes when their about die not their proper name.
Because Superman thought he was going to die so he told batman to save martha. That was the entire reason Superman was fighting batman - for his help to save his mom. I think logic can be thrown out the window when you've been weakened by kryptonite and a boot is crushing your throat while someone is about to kill you with a spear :)
He went there for bats help but never even asked for it. The logic would actually dictate you do the opposite of what you are saying..You would revert back to your most innocent self when put in peril so supes should have said save my mom not Martha. The whole reason for the fight was flimsy but I know you enjoyed the film so I won't try to take your enjoyment of it with me saying negative things about it...
He did ask for help. Remember - after the rooftop scene with Lex - Superman lands and tells batman he doesn't want to fight. He needs his help. Instead of help from bats he gets blasted by sonic machines and .50 cal guns.
Well that depends. In most cases where people revert back to their childhood and call for mommy, it's because they long for the protection of their parents. Superman was trying to have batman save his Mom, he wasn't reverting to a child-like state.
In fact here’s the dialogue from IMDB. I think it makes some points:
Batman: [suffocating Superman with his foot on his throat] You were never a god. You were never even a man!
Superman: [hardly breathing] You're letting them kill Martha...
Batman: What does that mean? Why did you say that name?
The only thing these movies have in common is that at some point superheroes fight each Other, idk why this thread exists.I read the initial post and it was reaching at best.
Government oversight through the UN with the accords is not the same as a congressional hearing to hold SM accountable and question him. The former seeks to delegate when and where the Avengers are allowed to intervene and the other is a hearing.
Lex poorly orchestrated the whole plot and was a hollow character while Zemo was fleshed out and only exacerbated an existing problem by manipulating political climate and the winter soilder.
BM and SM never had a dialogue and were never friends before so their dynamic was vastly different than Tony and CA who are friends and not a) paranoid xenophobes with no regards to other life b) mopey figures with a Messiah complex
There was no third act monster movie reject in CW
I could keep going but the bottom line is this thread is a reductionist look at two very different movies complaining about imagined slights because one of them was terrible. CA:CW was a better movie. It was great. That doesn't mean DC isn't a good company and won't make good movies, it's just that BvS wasn't as well put together. Whether that makes it bad is up to the viewer ultimately but the Box office agrees with their sharp decline, critis agree and a lot of movie goers agree. If you liked it, fine. That's okay, no one can tell you how to feel, but don't whine when other people have opinions that differ.
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